It feels so good to be back!
I left Kuala Lumpur and arrived in Chiang Mai this past Monday. Oh welcomed me at the Chiang Mai airport with a sign. She’s too cute.
I’ve been reunited with both my partner and my adopted home. It’s a massive relief.
To say that I didn’t enjoy my five weeks in Malaysia would be a massive understatement. I’ll delve into this a bit.
Before I do, just to recap, I flew to Kuala Lumpur at the end of December in order to buy time for Oh’s house sale so that we could be free to go off on grand adventures together for most of 2020.
Due to increasingly restrictive visa policies in Thailand, I ran out of time in the country.
I was originally going to rely on a combination of tourist visas to stay in Thailand for 2020, but the immigration stance was rapidly changing/tightening and that began to strike me as a poor/risky idea. It was a short-term and impractical solution to a more long-term problem.
Oh and I then had a series of conversations and devised three different long-term options to stay together, which I laid out toward the end of 2019.
We decided on the third option; however, Oh ran into severe difficulty regarding the sale of her house after her buyers backed out. It’s highly unlikely that we’ll be able to unload the house in the near future.
So I found myself in Kuala Lumpur pointlessly. The reason I was there in the first place – buying time for the sale of a house and the start of adventures – ceased to exist.
At the same time, I was completely bewildered by the place.
If you follow me on social media, where I update everyone on my early retirement life abroad in real-time, you already know that I didn’t like Kuala Lumpur pretty much from the start.
I’ve lived in and visited cities big and small all over the world. I spent my childhood in a crack house in Detroit. Lived the small-town life for my high school years. Spent almost a decade in Florida. Seen much of the US. Vised Central America numerous times. And I’ve been living abroad for more than two years, checking out a large chunk of SE Asia in the process. This is to say, I’ve been around. It’s not my first rodeo.
But I’ve never in my entire life experienced anything quite like Kuala Lumpur. And I mean that in the worst way possible.
I’m going to quickly brush the past five weeks aside. I don’t enjoy dwelling and complaining, nor do I enjoy hearing others dwell and complain. There’s nothing to gain from it. I’m an optimistic person who prefers to focus on the positive aspects of life. I just keep moving forward, no matter what.
However, just to be fair and transparent, I’ll run down a few key reasons why I didn’t enjoy Kuala Lumpur.
Extreme racism, rampant homelessness, the constant spitting everywhere, incredibly slow internet, food that’s barely edible, the miserable populace, tension, aggression, and poor infrastructure almost across the board.
The place looks great on paper. But the reality I saw with my own two eyes is far different.
Everyone is different, though. I’m sure others might love the place.
But I will say that I’ve heard from plenty of other people about KL – after I decided to go there and share what I was going through.
In this “age of outrage”, nobody wants to be honest and upfront. It seems like everyone is afraid of offending people. I can’t even tell you how many people have privately and discreetly told me about their horrible experiences in Kuala Lumpur/Malaysia, but they have no desire to publicly express any of that.
The descriptors I’ve heard from others that most accurately portray Kuala Lumpur are “dysfunctional” and “joyless”.
That sums it up. If Thailand is the “land of smiles”, Malaysia is the “land of frowns”.
However, I did get very, very lucky. It could have been much worse.
I was supposed to remain in KL until mid-March. I booked a condo room on Airbnb until then, which lasted the duration of my allowed three-month stay (no visa required).
Oh and I were thinking it’d take a few months for her to wrap a number of things up in Thailand – the sale of her house, the ending of her job, etc. And since I received three months in Malaysia, it was perfect.
Well, it was quickly apparent that the room wasn’t as advertised. And the host was immediately hostile toward me. It was highly bizarre and uncomfortable.
I quickly documented the issues and shared all of it with Airbnb, but they were unhelpful. From what I’ve gathered, they don’t like to get involved unless it’s some kind of emergency.
Fortunately, after five weeks of staying there, an emergency did occur.
The host was kind of obsessed over electricity usage and keeping his electric bill down. He kept almost everything in his two-bedroom condo (I was renting the second room) unplugged. And he kept the air conditioning in the main living area and his room turned off. Yes, he kept the air conditioning turned off 24/7. In one of the hottest and most humid cities in the world.
That was not going to work for me.
I kept the air conditioning turned down pretty low in my room (it had its own temperature control) in order to compensate for the fact that the rest of the condo was like a sauna.
After he received his electricity bill, the guy started to berate me. I videotaped said berating. Then I sent it to Airbnb, at which time they opened a case to investigate what was going on.
The host didn’t like that at all. He then threatened me with physical violence.
So I went down to the police station to file a police report, because this guy seemed to be pretty serious about causing me physical harm. The police, shocked to hear about all of this, completed a report and escorted me back to the condo in order to possibly start an investigation. This only served to anger the host further, upon which time he physically assaulted me – with the police present.
It then became an emergency. Airbnb verified the situation, apologized, immediately canceled my reservation, and issued me a refund.
I had to book a hotel on the spot, which I reserved for two days.
Seeing as how staying in Kuala Lumpur, a city I now regard with disdain, served no further purpose, I decided to come back to Chiang Mai and regroup after the most baffling set of encounters I’ve ever run across.
I’m so happy and grateful to be back. Seeing Oh at the airport with her sign filled my heart with joy.
I spent five weeks in what I like to call “stoic mode”. This is a switch I flip on whenever I’m going through some kind of difficult challenge. I basically numb myself to everything around me and become laser focused on an end objective of some kind. It works brilliantly. But it’s not a very nice way to go through life. It’s designed as a temporary measure only.
Coming back to Thailand meant I was able to flip this switch off, which gave me great comfort.
Oh and I stayed in close contact throughout the stay in Malaysia. After the home buyers fell through, we had to go back to the drawing board and revisit our remaining options, as the plan to travel together for the foreseeable future wasn’t going to work.
I’ll soon share exactly what we plan to do.
All that said, the stay in KL wasn’t a total loss.
I was given renewed perspective on just how wonderful Thailand is and how fortunate I am to live here. I’m not totally sure I needed this – almost all of the content I’ve produced over the last two years has gushed with gratitude. I mean, 5 Steps To Retire In 5 Years has me literally jumping for joy on a Thai beach. But it’s always nice to be reminded.
In addition, my five-year-old laptop crashed on the same night that my Airbnb host went nuts. That certainly made the situation even more frustrating. The good news is, electronics are significantly cheaper in Malaysia than Thailand. Laptop prices can be positively outrageous in Chiang Mai. But I scooped up a new HP laptop on the cheap right before I left KL. That was a score.
Lastly, Oh and I signed a lease on a beautiful condo. Taking a fresh and necessary look at the accommodation choices in Chiang Mai revealed some fantastic options. The condo is only about 500 meters away from the apartment I was renting before. However, it’s nicer, cheaper, and in an even better location than that apartment. I can throw a rock to everything I use on a daily basis – the gym, coffee shop, market, etc. We couldn’t be happier about it. I will publish some pictures and details about it before the end of the month.
I’ve been reunited. And it feels so good.
Back to normal life and everything I’ve worked so hard to attain and enjoy. “Stoic mode” off.
What do you think? Ever been to Kuala Lumpur? Have you had a crazy travel experience?
Thanks for reading.
P.S. If you’re interested in achieving financial freedom and retiring early, make sure to check out these fantastic resources that I personally used on my way to becoming financially free at 33!
Jason….all I can say is wow. I’m glad you made it back to Thailand
Shirts,
Thanks. I’m glad, too! 🙂
Best regards.
Jason,
That was a bad experience but glad to hear you are safe. I have been reading your posts since the DM days and you always make lemonade out of lemons!
I know you are very set in not wanting a house or getting married but in life, things change.
Since you love Oh and Thailand so much then reconsider marrying her. She will feel so much more secure and will benefit you both.
Another option is to get an elite visa as you mentioned which will buy 5 more years. Life is short and is unexpected. 16.5K is nothing if it provides 5 years of peace and happiness. Sometimes in life there are no free lunches so you gotta pay to buy some happiness. 16.5K over 5 years is $270/mo extra to live in Thailand. 16.5K is about a yearly expense to rent a studio or a 1 BR in some parts of the US. Within 5 years, you can decide getting married since you would have dated more than 2 years.
Adam
Adam,
Lemonade is so much better than lemons. 🙂
As for marriage and the elite visa, I already laid those out as two of three long-term options for us. The third being travel. That’s something I was repeatedly noting throughout this article, so I thought that was clear?
https://www.mrfreeat33.com/thailand-is-kicking-me-out-heres-what-were-doing-now/
Best regards.
Hi Jason,
What a great article. Congratulations on coming back home. That’s great news all around.
I had a year of hell living in the Middle East after many years in Thailand. It was a dysfunctional place also- ridiculous employment situation, the weather was the worst I’ve witnessed in the world and the attitude of the locals was frequently toxic and entitled. Fortunately it came to an end and returning to Thailand was wonderful.
I believe those types of experience are helpful to our happiness as we have another comparison point to frame our normal existence as an expat.
Take care,
Mike
Mike,
Thanks, man. It feels really, really good to be back! 🙂
Sounds like the Middle East and Malaysia have a lot in common. Religion, toxic attitudes, ridiculous weather, etc.
This definitely gave my gratitude some reinforcement, although I was already pretty well maxed out before going. I’ll chalk it up as a great learning experience and something to look back on in case I ever think life here is anything but wonderful.
Best wishes!
Wow, that’s insane. My wife visited Indonesia 22 years ago and she enjoyed it. It must have changed significantly over the years. She said you probably should have gone out of KL to some smaller city.
Glad to hear you’re back in Chiang Mai. It sounds like a much better fit for you (and me…)
Hopefully, you can work something out with the visa and stay for a while. Good luck.
Joe,
Kuala Lumpur is actually in Malaysia. Indonesia is a totally different country.
I personally prefer larger cities over smaller cities, all else equal. I love Bangkok, which is more than three times bigger than KL. However, KL is filled with racism and palpable tension in a way I’ve never come across before. Haven’t seen something like it since my time in Detroit. But to each their own. I certainly wish more expats would live there instead of Thailand.
I’m really glad to be back in Thailand. I was watching an interview with Carlos Ghosn the other day where he talked about how he felt “reborn” after escaping Japan and landing in Lebanon. Well, I feel the same after escaping Malaysia and coming back to Thailand. 🙂
Best regards.
Oops, I meant Malaysia.
Wow what a trip and story. You could probably make movie out of that experience.
Have you decided on one of your 3 options to stay in Thailand, or is there an option 4 now? The $275 a month expense for an Elite Visa might be worth it your truly that happy as it sounds to stay there. This is like a tax but your are contributing to their infrastructure which you and other ex-pats do use. Roads, sidewalks, parks, keeping beaches clean and groomed, subsidized transit, etc. It’s kind of fair in a way depending on how you look at it.
It would also reduce any fear that you could get pinched by a customs officer waking up on the wrong side of the bed the day you renew, and be cast out at an inopportune time.
Paul,
It was a hell of an experience. Not one I’d like to repeat. But it’s all in the past now. I’m just grateful to have my life back to normal. 🙂
Oh and I had to go back to the drawing board and discuss the prior options we already devised and ran through. The third option didn’t work, so it’s really only the other two at this point. We already decided what to do and started that process. As I noted near the end of the article, I’ll go over all of that in the near future.
Cheers!
Has anybody told you that you and Oh look alike? She is your better half, man!
German,
We’ve heard that before. I think it’s because we have round faces, chubby cheeks, and similar eyes.
She’s definitely my better half. I like to tell people she’s 90% of our combined 100%. 🙂
Best regards.
Sounds like you went through an ordeal, happy to hear you were able to cancel and go back to Thailand. Unfortunate to read that you did not like KL, it has been on my list of places to slow travel. I will still probably go but will now maybe make a short term accommodation first before I commit to something longer.
I enjoyed my 3 months in Chiang Mai, but I probably won’t go back until the visa situation gets better. I’m guessing the drop in Chinese tourists in 2020 may help the situation.
Tony,
KL is the only place in SE Asia that I’ve experienced anything like this. Thailand is obviously my favorite. Vietnam is pretty solid. Laos isn’t developed much, but the people are kind.
KL has this strange mixture of Muslims, Indians, and Chinese. And it’s very apparent that none of them like each other… or anyone else. It’s a widely documented thing, but people who only show shots on Instagram of their rooftop pools overlooking the Petronas Towers won’t say anything about it because they have an agenda and narrative to push.
Cheers.
Hi Jason,
Surely you aren’t implying that the travel blogging community sometimes has an agenda to embellish dire places in order to increase blog traffic and imply an artificial life that is in fact an enigma? Say it isn’t so..
I thought all those heavily filtered instagram pics were real…way to burst the bubble.
Good to see you happy and back where you belong, life’s too short to be miserable.
Take care,
DD4L
DD4L,
Sorry to burst your bubble. 😂
Thanks for the support. It’s great to be back. It’s probably not terrible to be reminded every few years of just how fortunate you really are.
Best regards.
Damn. Sounds like you checked into the Malaysian version of the Bates Motel! That guy probably had a dead body in a rocking chair stashed somewhere out of sight. I hope the police arrested him after he assaulted you, and that AirBNB barred him from using their service.
Tim,
I’ve met people all over the world. Been writing for nine years now. Never shared anything like this before because it’s never happened before. Just a very, very bizarre experience from top to bottom. I will say that I probably won’t use Airbnb in the future only because they’re unhelpful when issues pop up. It took an assault corroborated by police to get out of the place. That’s pretty extreme.
Best regards!
Glad to see you are back in a place that makes you happy, and not stuck in Kuala Lumpur. Being in a location, and with people, that make you happy is the best thing in the world. Good post as always Jason.
Mitchell,
Back to the good life. I’m extremely fortunate. 🙂
Thanks for the support!
Best wishes.
I spent a month or so in Malaysia a few years back. My girlfriend had to go back home early so was stuck in KL for almost a week by myself and found it a bit shit. Your description of KL as joyless and dysfunctional is about right. I was bored out of my brain.
Other parts of Malaysia were significantly different, so much better. Malacca for example is a lovely little town.
I thought the food there was great tbh, so i’m looking forward to visiting Thailand, it must be incredible.
I’m wondering how much of your hatred for Malaysia is because of the comparison with Thailand and because you were missing Oh?
Glad you’re in a better place now.
Adam,
Yeah, I think “dysfunctional” and “joyless” sum it up well.
The food isn’t even close to Thailand, or really even most places in Asia. There’s a reason why Malaysian restaurants aren’t all over the world. Society has collectively agreed on certain cuisines (Thai, Italian, Japanese, Chinese, etc.) and promoted them to the forefront. Malaysian food has been correctly demoted. Tried a dozen or so different dishes there. The food is edible, I guess.
“I’m wondering how much of your hatred for Malaysia is because of the comparison with Thailand and because you were missing Oh?”
Didn’t really have anything to do with that. I’ve been to Laos and Vietnam since coming to Thailand and being with Oh. Laos isn’t developed yet, but the people are nice enough. Vietnam is just fine. I personally prefer Bangkok, but Saigon is a place I could easily live in. If you follow me on Twitter, you’ll see the timestamps. I was having issues with KL right from the start. I document the good and bad. Most of my experiences in Asia have been awesome. This one wasn’t.
Cheers.
Damn Jason,
I’ve lightly followed your Twitter stories regarding Malaysia and knew you weren’t liking it, but I had no idea it was this bad. I’ll say thank God you were alone and Oh didn’t have to have this idiot physically assaulting her.
Speaking of the host being an idiot, was he crazy to attack you!? Even if the police weren’t there, you are a pretty big guy. I wouldn’t mess with you. Also, I think you should post the video you mentioned of him threatening you (if you haven’t done so already). God forbid that guy remains an AirBnB host and continued to treat unsuspecting people this way. Hopefully someone will see the video and be warned away by it. Plus, I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t morbidly curious to see it.
Lastly, I should point out that “Malaysia” kinda sorta not really had the word “malaise” in it. Kind of a red flag 😏
Sincerely,
ARB–Angry Retail Banker
ARB,
Yeah, I’m really glad Oh wasn’t there. If Oh would have been able to sell her house, we would have moved on. Malaysia was more of a convenient launching pad for our adventures than anything else anyway. But I guess it all worked out for the best.
The host was actually a pretty big guy himself. But his size didn’t matter to me. I wasn’t at all interested in fighting anyone. I wanted to instead use his aggression against him and get out of the place. I’m kind of glad it happened, though. Opened my eyes to what Airbnb is all about. They can be very unhelpful when an issue pops up. Probably won’t use them in the future. I’d rather just stay at a hotel.
Best wishes.
Everything happens for a reason and I’m sure your visit to KL was to meant to spur new found feelings about Thailand. Even in the darkest of times, we should always look for the light.
DGX,
There were definitely some good things that came out of the trip, as I noted. I’m not sure I needed to be reminded of how fortunate I am, as that’s something I’ve been harping on for the last couple years, but it worked out that way. I see it as win. 🙂
Cheers.
Hi Jason,
Thanks for sharing your experience on KL, I admire your honest and direct approach on reflecting your personal experience. It is what make this blog different from others. Others tend to sugar coat most of
the negative and focus on the positives only.
I noticed one of your tweets highlight an incident of been attacked by a Homeless person in KL, this also indicates Security risk … I am glad you are back to CM with your other half enjoying the kind warm welcome and the smiles on the Country of the smiles. :).
I hope the visa situation don’t hinder your ability to enjoy CM living and you can continue to contribute by share your experience on the blog.
ATM,
Thanks. I appreciate that. I’ve done my best to provide honest and thoughtful reflections as I’ve traversed life both before and after FIRE. Most of my experiences (especially in Asia) have been wonderful, and I consider myself a very fortunate guy. But some experiences haven’t been great. My time in Malaysia is part of that latter group, unfortunately.
Life back in Chiang Mai has been fantastic. Oh and I have been regularly discussing how nice it is to have our life back together. The long-term solution to this visa situation has already been put in motion. I’ll be living here for many years to come. 🙂
Best wishes.
Jason,
I am shocked! I can hardly believe what happened. Your KL host must have some kind of mental problem. Was he arrested?
DL,
KL was… an experience. It actually reminded me of America. And not in a good way. The homelessness, anxiety, tension, racism, etc. It’s not a nice place.
Not sure what happened with the host. The police were going to follow up with me, but I left the country and no longer use the Malaysian number they have on file. My primary mission was to get out of the Airbnb and overcome Airbnb’s objections. Mission accomplished. 🙂
Cheers.
Sorry to hear about your bad experience in Malaysia. I actually cancelled a trip to KL years ago because I saw some horrible racist stuff on Youtube. Don’t take it personal. KL has a long reputation of mistreating foreigners. Just be thankful that you got out of that place and it’s in the past.
I highly recommend doing a thorough Youtube search for all types of content – personal trips, police cases, attacks, etc. I spend hours researching a place inside and out before I go there.
I grew up in Washington DC in a minority neighborhood so I’m used to the same stuff you experienced in Detroit. I’m done with the aggressive, thug mentality so I simply cross off any countries that give me unnecessary headaches. Even though I haven’t been to KL, I know there are much better countries out there.
My advice would be to enjoy Thailand as much as possible. Sure, the visa laws are annoying but you get what you pay for. Thailand has everything a dividend expat needs to enjoy post-corporate America retirement to the fullest. Just be glad you are in a position of strength due to your upbringing and world class dividend portfolio.
Lastly, perhaps this experience puts things in perspective. The grass isn’t always greener on the other side. Be thankful for what God gives you and enjoy the moment!
investor trip,
Yeah, I hear you there. I did quite a bit of research on KL before I went, but a lot of the people who live there or travel there talk like the racism/cultural thing isn’t as bad as it’s been made out to be. Andrew over at Nomad Capitalist is especially guilty of sugarcoating it, in my opinion. I heard “overrated” from travelers and expats alike. Always an agenda with people. If anything, after experiencing it firsthand, I’d say it’s more underrated than anything else. And that’s coming from someone who grew up white in Detroit.
That said, I didn’t feel the need to know KL inside and out, like Thailand, because I wasn’t moving there. Some people seem to be under the impression that I was going to stay there or live there. As I noted repeatedly, it was only a nearby launchpad for our trips (once the house was sold). It was close to Thailand and offered an easy visa for a temporary stay to buy time for a house sale. That’s it. The only unfortunate thing about it is that it couldn’t even fulfill a three-month stay for me because of how bad it is.
As for Thailand, I love it. I have a dream lifestyle here. Before I moved abroad, I felt like Thailand offered me the highest QOL at the lowest COL. I still feel that way today. The only issue, which presented itself toward the latter half of 2019, is the sudden and severe tightening up on visas. There’s been an entire regime change here. We had three options to work around it. The third option (travel) didn’t work out as planned, due to the house sale not panning out. No big deal. Oh and I went back to the drawing board, revisited the other two long-term solutions, and picked the one that we’re both most comfortable with. As I wrote above, I’ll be going over that soon. 🙂
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the matter!
Best wishes.
Pay the money. Buy the expensive Visa. Use some of those stocks.
Wade,
We’ve already set our plan in motion. Should be complete within the next month or so.
Cheers.